The Fundraising Courtship: Strong Relationships and Engaging Events as the Bedrock of Any Nonprofit

Plan Better EventsSmart Event TipsLeadership InsightsPodcast

Aug 17

With Guest Susan Jacobson, President of Glavin Jacobson

Susan Jacobson is a leading expert in nonprofit fundraising, with over 20 years of experience in nonprofit administration, events, and now consulting. She is the President of Glavin Jacobson, a nonprofit consulting firm she co-founded after holding executive positions at a variety of nonprofits in San Francisco and pursuing consulting independently. At her firm, Susan specializes in major gifts, supporting nonprofits as they strive to strengthen and maintain relationships with donors.

Here’s a glimpse of what you’ll learn:

How did Susan Jacobson become passionate about fundraising?
What exactly is a major gift?
How is fundraising similar to dating?
Understanding different types of nonprofits
The importance of events for nonprofits and how to make sure they succeed
How to succeed as a nonprofit in a virtual world
Who are Susan’s mentors?
What is Susan most excited about in the nonprofit field?

In this episode…

Running a successful and impactful nonprofit has more similarities to dating than you might think. Emphasizing human connection, having constructive conversations, and repairing deteriorating relationships are just as essential to finding love as they are to securing a major gift from a donor. How? Susan Jacobson, a Robinhood of nonprofit consulting, explains.

When she consults with clients, one of the first things Susan does is identify relationships with donors that could be stronger. Maintaining these personal connections drives nonprofit staff and board members to host engaging events, connect with their audience, and ultimately form additional fruitful relationships. Plus, thousands of meaningful conversations happen along the way.

In this episode of Solution Seekers with host Paige Buck, listen in on a constructive conversation between peers in the nonprofit space with guest Susan Jacobson, co-founder and president at the nonprofit consulting firm Glavin Jacobson. Susan talks about all things in nonprofit success. Their conversation highlights her thoughts on making connections with donors to acquire major gifts, hosting events in a virtual world, and diversification within the field.

Resources Mentioned in this episode

Sponsor for this episode…

This episode is brought to you by Kennedy Events.

Kennedy Events is excited to bring you Solution Seekers! At Kennedy Events, we create stress-free conferences and events, providing expert management and design for all your corporate event needs—from in-person to hybrid + virtual events.

Events are stressful, time-consuming, and expensive, making you feel exhausted and set up for failure before you’ve even begun.

Kennedy Events provides expert management and design for all your event needs—from in-person to hybrid and virtual. Our proven process makes the experience stress-free and even fun; freeing you up to focus on your marketing efforts, sales enablement, and leadership priorities.

Schedule a consultation today to discuss how we can guide your next live, in-person, or virtual corporate event on the road to success!

Episode Transcript

Intro 0:04

Welcome to The Kennedy Events Podcast where we feature top marketing, communications and the future of work leaders and share their biggest takeaways and insights. We love these conversations and hope you will too. Let's get started.

Paige Buck 0:24

Welcome This episode is brought to you by Kennedy Events. We create stres-free conferences and events providing expert management and design for all your corporate event needs, from in-person to hybrid and virtual. You can learn more about us at Kennedyevents.com. Today, I am delighted to be speaking to Susan Jacobson, president of Glavin Jacobson, an organization focused on helping nonprofits flourish with a focus on strategic fundraising, board development and management. She works with organizations to design and implement fundraising programs to secure philanthropic support, with a special focus on major gifts from individuals. Susan is passionate about fundraising and financing social change, and she coaches senior leaders and how to cultivate, solicit and steward donors to maximize support. Welcome, Susan.

Susan Jacobson 1:19

Hey, nice to be here. Paige, thank you for inviting me to join in today.

Paige Buck 1:24

I'm so glad to have you here. I would love to just start at the beginning. How in the world did you get started in this career in this line of work?

Susan Jacobson 1:32

You know, I don't know too many people who grow up thinking they're going to be a fundraiser when they grow up. It's really not like firefighters or cowboys. Not one of those professions is visible and obvious to children. What happened to me is I got out of college and I knew how to type and I had an English degree. And it turned out the typing was more lucrative in the market at that time. And so I became an administrative assistant to someone who hated to write. And so I could argue that was my path in is that I knew I wanted to save the world. So working in a nonprofit made sense to me. And I started out as her assistant. And then she didn't want to write a report. I wrote it for her. It was a report to a thunder. And then I wrote a grant proposal and then money came in. And then the idea that I could just write something and somebody would send a big check. It just that was it. I was like, Okay, so this is it.

Paige Buck 2:26

So I want to pick up even earlier, you knew you wanted to save the world. Tell me about that.

Susan Jacobson 2:34

You know, I don't know exactly how I came to that. I think I always wanted to save the world. I think it really starts with an inflated sense of ego that you think you can say. Yeah, I really knew I had the calling to you know, do something that was bigger and beyond me. Maybe it's because I'm an Aquarius. What do you think?

Paige Buck 2:55

Interesting. I'm I am astrologically challenged, but I do know some Aquarius aquaria? Yeah, I guess that probably fits with my thinking of them too. Like the one I know is a supreme court clerk. So no slowly ambitions is that the right theory?

Susan Jacobson 3:11

Just exactly, exactly. You know, Aquarius are, are drawn to saving humanity and the big ideas of humanity. And that was always me.

Paige Buck 3:20

Well, what you said about your, you know, opportunity to sort of prove yourself with writing skills. Once you proved yourself as a grant writer, I'm, I'm surprised they didn't chain you to that desk, lock you in a basement and never let you out? Because that's an incredibly sought after talent in the nonprofit world. How? How did you escape that into bigger things? How did you grow beyond the grant writing and into the bigger picture of fundraising?

Susan Jacobson 3:51

So grant writing was my entry portal. And in the events world, you see other people enter through events, there are people who come into fundraising from events. Mm hmm. I did the grants. And like many small nonprofits, you know, there wasn't, you know, we didn't have enough staff to specialize. So you had to kind of help out with other projects. And so I got used to then writing letters for support. And from there, I did get involved in events. And I had a long period of my career where I did direct mail, direct fundraising, and got excited about the data analysis and all of that, but I think I'm a people person. So eventually getting out front with people ended up being what I wanted, both the grant writing and the direct response are really desk fundraising. And I wanted more kind of on the street fundraising. Face Time. Yeah, working with volunteers, working with board members, working with executive directors, running staff, you know, all that. Getting out with people part of me, it's only been in the middle and later part of my career that I really specialized in gifts from individuals And that really has to do with the fact that 90% of money given every year is given by individuals. There's a big market for fundraising.

Paige Buck 5:09

That's something that I don't know if even Fundraising Professionals in house organizations appreciate that 90% of giving is done by individuals, not no one is coming to save us in our institutions. Government. Right.

Susan Jacobson 5:23

Right. Yeah. No, it each organization has slightly different market and slightly different opportunity. Yeah, surely you see that in, in the events world, that the kinds of events that organizations are capable of producing vary and what they need is different? Yeah, sure. And fundraising generally, right?

Paige Buck 5:43

Every organization has a different story to tell and connection they need to make. How did you? What were some big turning points for you, you, you are now in consulting. How did that come about?

Susan Jacobson 6:01

I started, I consulted twice in my career. I did it once when I had young children at home. And I needed a period to be with my children. And I just kind of hung out a shingle and did some sort of contract work kind of consulting. It's really valuable. And I really learned a lot from it. But I really wanted to get back inside once my children were a little bit older. So I went back client side when my kids were both in school. And so then, eight years ago, not almost nine years ago, my husband retired. And I decided at that point to go to consulting and join the company, I'm in with a good friend of mine, Bob Glavin. Because I knew I wanted a more flexible life. Then once my husband was at home, you know, we were trying to figure out how we were going to balance, we're slightly different ages, and how are we going to balance our our lives, things are different if one of us was fully retired, and the other one was fully working. And at that point, you know, managing the staff and working in a university fundraising office, and you know, with that kind of level, and so I shifted back to Consulting at that point, and love it, just love it.

Paige Buck 7:12

Amazing. And that flexibility and that shift in lifestyle. I think you must have been fortunate that that came before COVID forced all sorts of people into Interesting, interesting new work scenarios.

Susan Jacobson 7:27

We were already working from home. Yeah. positions based on working from homes that ended up being the seamless part of it.

Paige Buck 7:34

Yes. Yeah. Well, you're lucky. I mean, I know, you know, we were already working virtually as a team as well. And it was like, some people were coming to us saying, how do you do that? And you're like, how do you do what?

Susan Jacobson 7:46

Like, it's not that hard. But you get up and go to work? Has to be right here at my computer. Right?

Paige Buck 7:52

Just take it for granted that it becomes second nature. But I think you're Yeah, that was a fortunate timing. Um, what we're so people come to your firm because they want to tap into major gifts. Can you explain even like, what does it mean? It's not just more money or bigger commitments? What does it even mean to go after major gifts? And what does that look like?

Susan Jacobson 8:20

So you know, a major gift, some people think a major gift is defined by the dollar amount, an organization major gift is the $1,000 or $10,000, or $50,000. In fact, what a major gift is, is it's a technique. So a major gift is transacted face to face with the donor, frequently through multiple interactions, preferably, including a board member, as well as staff, sometimes including written proposals, sometimes not. But it isn't a hey, Paige, would you give us $10,000? We're going to do X, or those are fundamentally annual gifts. Hmm, major gift is distinct from an annual gift, an annual gift is recurring. So if I asked you, Hey, give us $1,000. And you give it, you sort of assume I'm going to come back next year. Or if I sell you a table for the event, you assume I'm going to come back and ask you again, with a major gift. It's a one time investment in something. It's when I come to you and say, Paige, you know, we're going to expand the organization this way, we're building this building, we're tackling this new frontier, we're changing in this way, and we need your capitalization. We need your investment to be able to do this. And that's really what a major gift is often restricted, almost always restricted.

Paige Buck 9:44

Say more for folks who might not know about what restricted means.

Susan Jacobson 9:48

In nonprofit money there's a big bright line between restricted and unrestricted and unrestricted is what companies get they earn revenue and they can use the money they earn any way they like. And that's unrestricted. In a nonprofit, we get a lot of gifts that way where the donor just says, Hey, support your work, glad to help you, here we go or the event but or sometimes nonprofits earn some of their money school earns money from tuition, symphony or getting off ticket sales are restricted. When a donor says I want you to use this money to commission a new piece of work for the symphony. And I'm willing to pay you $50,000 Or give you $50,000 to do that. That's restricted gifts, you can't use the money to pay the musician salaries or anything I use it to commission a different piece of work for someone else if it's restricted to that. That restricted money is that special purpose? And understanding what my money is going to accomplish is what motivates a big gift. Yeah, yeah, help us have a great season, give us $10,000 is a big difference. From Hey, we want to commission new work from young composers, would you help us?

Paige Buck 11:05

So often new clients come to you looking to tap into this, and they're walking right in the door with a misunderstanding about what they even want and need? Right? That happens? For sure. So you're, you know, get the opportunity to educate and and build trust in the process. It's a great place for people to be coming in the door, like, you know, you, you don't even know what you need, let me help you. Right? And then what does, what does it typically look like for you to not just have that first layer of education, but then to take them on the journey to the tactics and the tools needed to secure major gifts themselves.

Susan Jacobson 11:48

So a couple of different things are typically in place when somebody comes to us, often some of the things they bring, or they say, Well, you know, we had these donors who did these big things for us in the past, but we don't really stay in touch with them that well, or they gave us this money three years ago, and we did x with it. But we haven't been able to get a meeting with them lately. So they often have some kind of relationships that have deteriorated at some point. They may have other people where they say, Well, we know that this group of people has a lot of capacity, but they're they're only giving us $5,000. And we want to build a building. And we know we need much bigger amounts of money. But we're not quite sure how to get these people who we know are wealthy, but they're only giving us 5000. We don't know how to get them to give more. So those are some of the kinds of specific issues organizations might bring to us. That might have a big new purpose that needs a much bigger amount of money. We're raising $5 million a year, but this building is going to cost 25 million. How do we get there? And we know that our donors, our biggest donor right now is giving 150,000. So how do we get to 25 million? That would be a typical kind of scenario we might hear from a client. And what we then work with them on is we work with them on a couple of things. One is how to get their board members engaged with their donors, so that there's more relationship building going on. And often organizations think, Oh, well, our board members don't have anybody in their address, but they don't know wealthy people. And our response to that is no, no, no, they're supposed to be getting to know the donors you do have. Doesn't matter if they know the donor, they're a board member, it's your job to introduce them. And so we'll go to work repairing those broken relationships and or strained relationships or relationships. And we teach board members how to be really effective with donors, even if they've never met the person before in their life.

Paige Buck 13:49

Yeah, I know, I resemble that remark. And I entirely like, oh, gosh, I don't know those people. Or if I do, they're, the nature of my relationship with them is not at all in the sphere of their giving. And so it was actually incredibly freeing to me. And we haven't touched on Hamilton families, you and I have sort of orbited around each other for years in the nonprofit fundraising space, and probably going back to when I was in house at nonprofits. And when we really had an opportunity to get to know each other is when I'm on the I'm on the board for of Hamilton families and you. I recommended you for some board development and strategic guidance, and it's just gone from there. But I know it was incredibly freeing for me to be like, Oh, you just want me to be in conversation with people. I don't need to know them like it's perfect for my like gregarious introvert nature. I can do that. I can do that. It's different for you.

Susan Jacobson 14:51

And your job is to volunteer and specific as a member of the board is specifically to explain how you got involved in why you're passionate about the cause and why you have Have confidence that the direction Hamilton is going in is a good one. Because people know you're doing it as a volunteer, and you're not paid for it. And so you automatically speak with a different voice and a staff member who is paid for it. And that's, that's just a different place. That's part of why it works. The other reason it works is how many board members up 20. And how many staff I see knows one, or you certainly twenty amplifiers in the community saying Hamilton is doing amazing work instead of one. And they're, you know, they're credible in a different way that staff are because of their independence, and they're giving their own money. So that combination, you know, creates this kind of halo of goodwill around the organization's cause. That's what we're good at building. That's what our company does is we help an organization like Hamilton, get the CEO on the board ready to be that, that Halo, and to really get out with your community and explain your cause in the way that builds relationships.

Paige Buck 15:59

So we build halos, and builds halos. The day I was

Susan Jacobson 16:04

on a conversation, both yesterday and today with different clients of mine about the same topic about why we don't just go in the door and say, Hey, what I really need is 5 million. Like, I can do that. And the way I was taught it is you think about it, like dating and sex. You don't really go into a date saying hey, I want to have sex. And you don't spend the whole date normally talking about sex.

Paige Buck 16:27

But and you're doing it wrong. If you're sitting there the whole time being like sex, sex, all I'm really waiting to say is sex, sex, sex.

Susan Jacobson 16:35

And why talk about who you are and how we know each other what we did, or was the movie any good, let's just talk about sex. But people do that with money. And they don't realize for many people money's is in the middle most SX go into donor rooms, all they're thinking about is how much money they get from this person might ask him for 10, or they're gonna give me 10. They have to I know they can do 10 Why we should definitely ask them for 10. And I've had people for, you know, surprising, be unable to get their mind off off the money. So what we really want, like a dating scenario, most dating scenarios is, you know, a chance to build a relationship that's going to be continuous and long lasting. Because if you and I build a good relationship, as a donor in an organization, you'll be with us a long time and you do lots of different things with us over time, there won't be this one gift one time, that that is the extent of your relationship. Yeah, I love that mind to do. I'm trying to build those long lasting relationships,

Paige Buck 17:33

right. And it's great, it's really great to shift the perspective because when you can move to like, human connection and emotion, reasons for doing something why you care, it's so much more compelling than just like, we need a thing. Give me money for it.

Susan Jacobson 17:49

Right transaction transaction. So I think of myself as kind of a Robin Hood, you know, I'm about redistributing wealth, love that. I'm about getting camels through the eyes of needles in religious terms, because I'm trying to get rich people into heaven. You know, it's all of that stuff. And I liked that role. I like being able to bring that joy into organizations.

Paige Buck 18:12

You were just touching on I think one of the reasons if you were to list like any of a number of reasons why people give, they're trying to get into heaven. Can you say more about that? There's so much in there, it's all and it's all really like Right? Very, very close to someone's heart and maybe even unexpressed or unrealized reasons. Yeah, he's more about that.

Susan Jacobson 18:37

Overwhelmingly out of the sweetest part of their, their natures. And so it's part of the joy of being in fundraising sending those of us in the field. Now, it's a you're with people at some of the most really joyous moments of their lives, when somebody makes a gift, a significant, meaningful, important gift, where they feel like this is my statement to the world. I'm supporting this. They're really in a great space, and we get to be there with them. Yeah, that's awesome.

Paige Buck 19:04

I'm gonna ask a real, what feels like a really basic question, but it's obviously close to my heart. What do you feel is the best role for events and fundraising.

Susan Jacobson 19:16

We see them in two places. And we recommend them in two places. And I should start by saying, I love events. You know, one of my favorite jobs ever, I was at an organization where we produce 50 events a year. So I love events, and I think they're critical in fundraising, but in two fundamentally different ways. So one set of events is the kind of big gala marquee, highly branded public face of an organization. And those are really important in fundraising because they establish a brand and for many organization's. And Hamilton would be an example. There aren't a lot of ways your donors get to interact with the Hamilton because they don't use Hamilton services. And they never will. It's not like a symphony or an opera, where you're going or museum where you're going all the time, or a school where your kids are getting educated, you don't really get a lot of direct, you know, interaction with the services of Hamilton

Paige Buck 20:23

as you can't, and you can't even cultivate an opportunity to do that without it becoming tokenizing. or feeling very just discomforting to both the people being served and the people who are giving,

Susan Jacobson 20:39

right, yeah, and so a gala event for a group like Hamilton is a place where people in the community can go and see their friends and peers and realize, oh, all of us are supporting Hamilton. And here's the chance for all of us to be in a room for Hamilton. For Hamilton, do you get his key talking points across to me, so once a year, it can really establish for me what's important about the organization. So I think for organizations that serve populations, where their don't so a big division in nonprofits is organizations whose natural constituencies can give them money. And that would be a university or a museum and organizations that don't, and that would be a homeless shelter, or other organizations that serve people who aren't, don't have money and aren't going to be able to pay back think tanks are in that second zone two, they don't really serve an actual market directly. organizations that don't have an actual market events are one of the few ways they can showcase who they are in front of the people they want.

Paige Buck 21:43

That's an important distinction. So then what do you think separates a stellar must attend fundraising event and let's separate out like the symphony and the ballet, you know, the black and white ball, right? But moving maybe towards something like, like, because it's still recent, I think in Bay Area Memory of the growth of a new organization, something like Tipping Point Community, which is created something that people really want to go to, in addition to support and understand the organization from, from an organization where guests attend, and feel joy once they're there, but are really signing up out of a sense of obligation.

Susan Jacobson 22:27

So then, the big marquee events don't generate donors. They generate ticket sales, and they generate flash, and they generate talk and buzz. And you can use them as a place to strategically cultivate a few donors. So if we're going to have our big annual event, I'm going to see that my best donors get there sit at the right table, and the chair of the board stops by to say hello, I will position them to get the best possible experience. So it becomes part of their cultivation. But it's a place where I'm gonna get a lot of new donors from we find in general, that donors to event stay donors to events, and they don't transfer. This role of events, though, and I know your company must do these too at times are the kinds of salons cultivation dinners, small events that don't have ticket prices attached to them. Right, that's where an organization is deliberately cultivating donors in smaller settings, to get to know them better, and to bring them closer to the organization. And that's a critical part of major gifts. So just as the big, the big splash events are great for general public awareness and community awareness, these smaller cultivation events are critical for stewarding and developing relationships with your high end donors. And so a good organization has both kinds of events going on.

Paige Buck 23:52

Right. And I think that distinction that you've hit on and getting crystal clear for an organization on the purpose and the goal is so critical to the internal orientation, like the effort that has to go into making that event a success, and then to the ultimate outcome, because I think we see and you probably do, too. Some clients come in with a misconception about what the purpose of the event is for them just like what is a major gift and, and trying to check all of the boxes, this event is going to make us a ton of money. It's going to get us over our goal for the year it's going to cultivate new relationships with major donors, it's gonna fundraise all these people who don't know, we're like, let's get into some of the one or two of those

Susan Jacobson 24:37

conditions and walk the dog don't forget that.

Paige Buck 24:40

Walk the walk, walk the dishes, walk the dog wash the dishes, right? And well and then and and truly be like, you know, in business terms, a profit center for the organization and not a cost center. And especially if that's a first time event, that's it. You have to just named a real tall order, not really even, you know, even those first couple things,

Susan Jacobson 25:04

this is the least efficient way to raise money is a very good note not efficient. Yes, direct mail is and grant proposals and major gifts, all the other ways of raising money, cost efficient, but none of them have the public exposure that a really successful event has. And I see those big events with our major donors as stewardship opportunities, not as bringing them in the door.

Paige Buck 25:31

Yeah, I think that's a big reality check. That that is, it's really important to be heard, like across the entire organization, because sometimes I imagine you might have that conversation with a development director. And she's like, Yep, I get it. And then, but try telling that to my CEO on my board,

Susan Jacobson 25:51

I just did this conversation with a potential client last week, who's closing down all the events that their organization has done, they've had eight new kinds of regular events for many years. And they, he wants to close them all down. They're not making any money. And I'm like, okay, but then you go dark to the community, and they're not going to see. So I get these are not meeting your needs, but what's going to replace them. I'm absolutely opposed to nonprofit organizations having no big events, except under unusual circumstances. Everybody needs a marquee event. Everybody needs that kind of branding in the community, and nothing else will get you there.

Paige Buck 26:28

You mean, TikTok isn't going to replace? No, not yet, anyway.

Susan Jacobson 26:35

And I've seen people try to do it. And and I think sometimes also that people who are trying to close it down, don't realize there's equity in those big events. And there's got equity way. And it might be we know how to produce them. We know how to get 500 people in a room.

Paige Buck 26:51

Right? We built that we built that muscle, we built that whole engine over here, yet don't let that atrophy.

Susan Jacobson 26:59

Right. Right. I and people are, I think sometimes cavalier about how much work it takes to learn how to do what a 10 year event that's been successful, actually has built in the organization in terms of reach. Usually, there's a volunteer committee that knows how to be the volunteer committee, their staff and know how to be the staff there. Yep. So even if it's getting a little stale, or refreshes in order, not a termination. And when I see people terminating, I'm always like, please, please think really long and hard before you make a decision like that.

Paige Buck 27:34

Yeah, yeah, that's, I think that's an important note. And it's like, it's a refreshing and probably a reorientation, again, like, why are we here? What is this energy going towards? Right? Fascinating.

Susan Jacobson 27:46

And how would we communicate as effectively? Because how often how hard? Is it in a PR sense, to get 500 of your donors to sit in a room for an hour listening to whatever you're gonna say to them?

Paige Buck 27:59

I mean, you can't get that another way. Right, right. I mean, it's hard enough now as it is to get even gather those. But if you've pulled that off, and you can replicate it, then don't, don't just pack it up and put it away. It's what I'm hearing. Yeah. Yeah. How has the work of board development and major gift cultivation shifted during COVID? If at all? Or what do you see for how the nature of our engagements is changed, like changes affecting us in the future?

Susan Jacobson 28:35

You know, it definitely has changed, a lot of major donors have stepped up, there's been tremendous generosity, many organizations have made more money than ever, partly because their costs have gone down. virtual events have been more profitable than actual events, because of all the costs that are withdrawn, so that even if they generate less money, they're writing far less cost. That's been a whole thing. Now people kind of burn out on them.

Paige Buck 29:02

Like, don't make me do this again, please, please. Yes. Write

Susan Jacobson 29:06

that joke about buffalo. You know, first place is one week in second place is two weeks. It's gonna be like that. But so what, what I would say is that, I think it has caused some organizations to become really adept at using zoom to have thoughtful small group interactions. The organizations among my clients that jumped onto that early and occasionally gave briefings online about issues that were happening, that were really successful at maintaining those relationships, right. They

Paige Buck 29:41

didn't have to go get a hotel ballroom and put out an invitation and spin up a registration platform. They can just get it out pretty quick and inexpensively.

Susan Jacobson 29:51

Yeah. And so if you have content to deliver, I think this new avenue of zoom, to have small gatherings for But then people had to really learn how to use it. 30 minutes is plenty interact with each other. I mean, they've been a lot less than Surrett. About how to and I'm sure your company give us advice on that. Like, yeah, that's how to make it work.

Paige Buck 30:13

Absolutely. I think one of the things we've seen happen now in as things open back up, and we can do live events, again, is that that has permanently shifted the way people give their attention. I mean, our attention spans were broken before COVID COVID just shined a light on how little attention we had to give. We have Instagram and Tiktok length attentions. And now we advise clients to not not to forget that when they go back to life, because now they're like, oh, I can have you for three hours, like, Bad idea. Bad idea. Yeah, people will resent you. Right? Yeah. So then you have to how are you going to make memorable? Let's say you are having a marquee, nonprofit fundraiser, how are you going to make many little bite sized moments that hook people and refresh their attention over and over? In the course of that time? It's really tricky.

Susan Jacobson 31:11

I always said to my teams, when we were doing events that I only cared about, you know, two things on events, and one was that there were people in seats, a full crowd. And second was that the message of our organization was carried appropriately from the front of the room. And, you know, like, like, that we were on top of with our messaging, whatever that might be, in this case, might be fragmented around the room, but different ways. But I didn't really care as much about the other pieces, because I felt like our purpose was executed by really getting people there and really getting our message right now. You know, I'm saying that to an events person, and you're the one who's responsible for all the other pieces, right? Oh, but

Paige Buck 32:01

I'm 100% with you on that. I mean, I find it. And we choose our projects carefully for this reason, because I find it exhausting. When your volunteer committee is obsessing over the color of the flowers and the centerpieces and and what heights should they be in? Or should we not have them? And I'm like, I, you will be shocked to learn I do not care at all. About those centerpieces, it's the least interesting part of our jobs. Our jobs are really and freeing you up to craft that message and get those butts in seats. Right, please, let's not discuss the flowers at all, let us take care of that for you. Spend your attention and your attention on other things,

Susan Jacobson 32:43

right? Because a full room just does something special. And it's really hard to get the message. Right.

Paige Buck 32:51

It's it is I think it is a lot harder than people think it is especially because these events kind of feel formula, right? And then and you get a donor to speak, you get the head of the organization to speak you get somebody served by the organization. And we're good, right? We're good.

Susan Jacobson 33:07

And and nobody checked his speeches against each other. So they all tell the same story. Oh, right. Oh, yes. You're one of them starts with it in the newspaper this week, I saw

Paige Buck 33:18

a guy. And I

Susan Jacobson 33:21

think the message isn't about is it accurate? Or do we have the right people speaking? But is it interesting in the way that people are going to walk out of the room feeling more engaged with our cause?

Paige Buck 33:34

Which I think that comes back to your human connection? How you how you train and articulate to board members and volunteers, the stories they're telling about why they're involved? Right? Yeah, yeah,

Susan Jacobson 33:49

gotcha, personal engagement. So what are some of the tricks you're doing to tick tok-ify a big event?

Paige Buck 33:55

No, no. I mean, I joke about tick tock, this comes into play quite a lot in corporate events where I think we can we and our clients can be guilty of just trying to like shove content into a conference. You know, I'm just gonna, I'm going to talk at you for an hour. I mean, the main thing I would say is we, during the shift to virtual, we advised folks to have a moment of interaction, right, every 10 minutes, like go for too much. So even if that's as simple as you know, in a virtual event, like drop a word or a phrase and chat about why you're involved, you know, or any any of a number of little things, you could launch a poll, have a hand raise, if we're all looking at one another, or send them into a breakout space to engage for a few minutes. Really aim for every 10 minutes. No more than that, creating that because you're you're sort of waking people up from their zoom stupor, right? We need the same the rest of us are like You know, we're on Zoom like this, you know, we're looking in the camera and thinking, I think my hair sticking up on the right side.

Susan Jacobson 35:06

Let me add it down. I don't know, the side is really the problem. Let me fix that, you know, that's really what's going on. That's where

Paige Buck 35:12

that's where your mind has gone. All right, we're all looking at ourselves are all Wow, absolutely,

Susan Jacobson 35:20

you know, up or down.

Paige Buck 35:21

Right? Or like I turned up five minutes ago, and I'm actually watching the Warriors game, right? You know. And so the same now needs to be true in person, we need to find ways to engage, interact, connect, and obviously, when you're sitting at a table with other people, and there's food being served, those some of those things are going to happen organically. But I think you have to think through the beats of your program in the same way. That's what I think keeps people who have again, like our brains are broken have broken our attention spans.

Susan Jacobson 35:55

Yeah, no, that's true. I think that's true. These hours and hours and hours. It's in it's every every 10 minutes. That's a good, that's a good rule of thumb. I love it.

Paige Buck 36:03

Yeah. So I'm curious, just to kind of like, wind down here. Who are some of your mentors? And what are some of the best pieces of advice you've been given?

Susan Jacobson 36:14

Oh, my goodness, Joe mixer was my mentor. And he was someone who founded the fundraising school and was kind of one of the people in the 70s, and 80s, who really brought modern fundraising together the way we all do it. Now many of the principles of fundraising, we all know Hank Rosso in our field, who was Joe Mixer's partner and launching The Fundraising School, I worked a little bit with Hank, but I work more with Joe. And he was the one who really taught me to think about it as a courtship. That you you need to take people through a series of steps to get to know them better before you pop the question. And that was used to draw spiral and say, you know, you're on this spiral with people as you move toward the center of the relationship he was, he was great, because he also was one of those people really communicated. That it's it's a loving gesture, to invite someone to join you giving money. Isn't love that hostile or antagonistic gesture? And it's not transactional? When done? Well, excellence relationship based? Yeah.

Paige Buck 37:22

And when

Susan Jacobson 37:23

I'm you found for me that it was a sweet thing.

Paige Buck 37:28

Yeah. And so now you have a team of folks you work with, and you've got some some folks who didn't come up in in the 70s, and 80s, honing, holding these, like, present day tactics? What do you see that's like, what do you learn from that? What's new and sparking you, from your, from your peers and your colleagues,

Susan Jacobson 37:51

I am extremely excited about the diversification of our of our field. And the work that's being done to tackle how we make philanthropy represent all that both the giving of money and the receiving of money, that we're diversifying on all sides of it. And, you know, that change in our there was a time when it was radical to talk about women in philanthropy. Now, we've gotten so far beyond that conversation. I'm really, really pleased. And I love seeing all kinds of people coming into the space and bringing all kinds of donors into the space as well, because I think that's where real organizational change occurs is when boards and staffs and donors are all working in on those issues together. And I know, we've got to Hamilton, I know you guys have really been doing that as

Paige Buck 38:46

well moving toward a world in which our, our boards, our volunteers, and our donors look like the communities that we represent. Yeah, I think that's amazing. Oh, that's wonderful. I'm excited about that, too. Well, Susan, this has been a delightful conversation. Where can our listeners go to find you and learn more about you?

Susan Jacobson 39:08

Well, we are on Facebook and LinkedIn and on our on the website, Glavin Jacobson, that's G L A V I N Glavin Jacobson with an o dot com. And, yeah, we love working with you Paige.

Paige Buck 39:24

I get so much out of out of your expertise. And we will also be sure to include those links in the show notes. So thank you. Thanks for being here.

Outro 39:39

Thanks for listening to The Kennedy Events Podcast. Come back next time, and be sure to click Subscribe to get future episodes.

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PAIGE BUCK

Paige Buck is the co-owner of Kennedy Events, a large-scale event management company based in San Francisco, Los Angeles, and New York City. Our team creates stress-free conferences and events with a positive impact, which allows our clients to resonate with their audience. Kennedy Events specializes in producing flawless product launches, award ceremonies, fundraisers, and multi-day conferences while keeping our eye on retention and engagement goals.

About Kennedy Events

Kennedy Events began with one goal in mind—to produce high-level corporate events with just as much strategy as style. Maggie founded the company in 2000, found her match in Paige, and in 2011 the two became official partners. Since then, these two resourceful and brilliant creatives have pooled their strengths to build one one of the most the most sought after corporate event companies in San Francisco, New York, and Los Angeles.